South Africa Youth Discussion

A place for players in South Africa to communicate.
Post Reply
werdo64
Posts: 136
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:26 am
Location: Australia

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by werdo64 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 1:02 am

Hellbound81 wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 7:50 am
simmo014 wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 6:32 am
Thanks for the update werdo. At this stage we would still like at least 1 more quality keeper but preferably 2 more. Also be handy to have a few more seamers, preferably LFM or LF but of course that's a bit more random.
Realistically though any additional $1k+ player is a bonus and a bit of depth and variety for us. Thank you to everyone for considering our future needs to make us competitive
We should also just keep in mind that sub $1k wage 16yos in deluxe academies will very likely have better all round development than above $1k wage players in low academies.

Then there is also the sad situation where managers just do not develop the exceptional talent they have properly, however this is quite normal with the game.
As simmo mentioned. The Youth Recruit updates will be separate from the other updates I will give.
I'm gathering all the info together into a spreadsheet for the different age groups with general information on numbers of players who are there, or thereabouts for NAT at the different age groups. Once I have collated all the data, I'll post what the requirements were/are (really rough guides), and the number of players that fill those different requirements.

werdo64
Posts: 136
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:26 am
Location: Australia

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by werdo64 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:05 am

Okay, I've finished collating all the numbers and can provide a broad overview of the players who are NAT Standard* or Fringe^.

Here are the definitions of NAT Standard* and Fringe^
* NAT Standard
16YO: (Reas Primary with Reas Tech)
17YO: (Cap Primary with Cap Tech)
18YO: (Reli Primary with Reli Tech)
19YO: (Accom Primary with Accom Tech and Reas Field)
^ Fringe
16YO: (Reas Primary with Ave Tech, or Ave Primary with Reas Tech)
17YO: (Cap Primary with Reas Tech, or Reas Primary with Cap Tech)
18YO: (Reli Primary with Cap Tech, or Cap Primary with Reli Tech)
19YO: (Accom Primary with Reli Tech and Reas Fielding, or Reli Primary with Accom Tech and Reas Fielding)

So, with all that taken into account, here is where we stand for each of the Age Groups:
16YO NAT Standard: 2 Bats, 6 Bowlers (3 x RM, 2 x RFM, and 1 x RF)
16YO Fringe: 14 Bats, 12 Bowlers (2 x LFS, 6x RM, 2 x RFM, 1x RF), 1 A/R (RM)

17YO NAT Standard: 7 Bats, 7 Bowlers (1x LM, 2 x RFS, 2 x RM, 2 x RF)
17YO Fringe: 21 Bats, 6 Keepers, 12 Bowlers (1 x LM, 1 x LFM, 1 x LF, 3 x RFS, 4 x RM, 2 x RFM) 1 A/R (RFS)

18YO NAT Standard: 8 Bats, 2 Keepers, 15 Bowlers (2 x LFS, 1 x LM, 1 x LFM, 1 x RFS, 1 x RWS, 8 x RM, 1 x RFM)
18YO Fringe: 18 Bats, 2 Keepers, 13 Bowlers (2 x LFS, 2 x LM, 2 x LF, 3 x RFS, 2 x RM, 2 x RFM) 1 A/R (LFS)

19YO NAT Standard: 12 Bats, 3 Keepers, 9 Bowlers (1 x LM, 2 x LFM, 2 x RFS, 2 x RM, 1 x RFM, 1 x RF) 1 A/R (RFM)
19YO Fringe: 11 Bats, 1 Keeper, 5 Bowlers (1 x LM, 2 x LFM, 1 x RFS, 1 x RM) 3 A/R (2 x RM, 1 x RF)

To start with here, these are pretty rough numbers because we were just looking at a couple of skills without taking any secondaries into account until 19YO, and even then those are pretty low.
We want to raise the standard of 19YO's so that they are Expert/Expert with Capable Fielding and Reasonable Endurance.

If you have any questions or want to know where your player is in the pecking order, please let me know and I'll do my best to let you know.

Thanks guys,
werdo64

werdo64
Posts: 136
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:26 am
Location: Australia

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by werdo64 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:31 am

Hellbound81 wrote:
Thu Feb 27, 2020 7:57 am
Thank you very much for your efforts to compile this information.

I think for next season it is clear that we are a bit short on spin bowlers, though we should be good on pace.

The number of allrounders coming through is very encouraging.
The difficulty is the training of these players.
If I search for 19YO Spin Bowlers with at least Reli/Reli, I've got 12 of them.
5 of them at least accom/reli or reli/accom.
The issue is secondaries. Of those 12, 7 of them don't meet our minimum fielding of Reasonable, and 2 of the 5 are at reasonable.
One of our best (Accom/Expert) has dreadful fielding!!

It's an issue I'll have a chat with simmo about. I'm not sure which managers he has and hasn't spoken with about training.

werdo64
Posts: 136
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:26 am
Location: Australia

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by werdo64 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:52 am

Hellbound81 wrote:
Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:45 am
It is quite incredible how poorly managers develop their players.

A potential NAT 19yo should have capable fielding to be very honest.

I personally try to keep fielding a level below primary.
I personally train all my players to keep their fielding at the same level as their primary (except in the case of one player who a nat manager requested a different training plan for).

boscorp
Posts: 1365
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2011 10:55 am
Location: on the coast near the sea

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by boscorp » Thu Feb 27, 2020 10:53 am

With it being U20 now anyone with fielding below reasonable fielding shouldn't need to be considered.
South Africa U19 Manager seasons 38-41.
Boscorp Cross season 14 - current

GM-crowfan65
CAPT
Posts: 24077
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 6:17 am
Location: Look...up in the sky
Contact:

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by GM-crowfan65 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:01 am

Even reas won't pass 50% of fielding in U20 games, on average
Master Crowfan of the Blessed Spreadsheet

GarageTM Foundation Member

thebof
Posts: 301
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 8:57 am

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by thebof » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:21 am

Hellbound81 wrote:
Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:09 am
But then I was looking at a 19yo FS on the market - Capable bowling, Expert fielding........ :doh
I'm trying something a bit different with my affiliate and how I train them. I'm happy with the progress of most of my players as they get older. Those that aren't good enough get sold.

GM-crowfan65
CAPT
Posts: 24077
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 6:17 am
Location: Look...up in the sky
Contact:

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by GM-crowfan65 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:31 am

I wouldn't say more than enough but that is as much as you are going to get from people I think
Master Crowfan of the Blessed Spreadsheet

GarageTM Foundation Member

simmo014
Posts: 1002
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:05 am

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by simmo014 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:32 am

And yet on this current tour we have had to select 1 x Average, 3 x Reasonable and 5 x Capable Fielding players. It's all well and good saying we need a certain level or tactics are to blame or luck or whatever but the reality is we are suffering from poor training and its not just Fielding. It's not going to change for the foreseeable future if we can't do 1 of 2 things; either change the current SA managers training the way they are or get a big enough pool of $1k+ 16yos coming through that those badly trained players are on the fringe of the 30 man squad and we are not being forced to select such players. Scary thing is the crop of 17 to 19yos are looking like going the same way and managers don't seem too receptive to change it. It will improve slightly with myself, werdo and Worm now actively recruiting and buying those potential stars but it's not going to be a complete solution

thebof
Posts: 301
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 8:57 am

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by thebof » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:39 am

I've won 4 YOD in a row in Zimbabwe which has been consistently the highest rated youth league. I've got a fair idea of what is needed from players. I'm trying something different with my affiliate with a longer term plan. It may or may not work. I'm not going to apologise for it.

Here's one of my players who had expert fielding at 17. There are better players, but there are also lots worse.

Steelboks >> 39. Conrad Stuurman >> Details
Player Info
22 years | 48,644 rating | $7,337 wage (7.5% discount)

Right hand batsman | Right arm Medium

Talents Gifted (Technique), Opener
Nationality South Africa South Africa
Form capable
Fatigue rested
Experience capable
Captaincy capable
Skills Summary
Batsman average
Bowler expert
Keeper average
Allrounder reasonable
Notes

Skills
Batting ordinary Endurance capable
Bowling outstanding Technique outstanding
Keeping ordinary Power ordinary
Fielding spectacular

simmo014
Posts: 1002
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:05 am

Re: Under 19 Matters

Post by simmo014 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:42 am

My post wasn't aimed at you thebof. It was a general observation of our current situation

Post Reply